He's 100% right though.Mr Creepy Crawley at it again doing his level best to destabilise and create a furore around Wests Tigers.This guy dines out on negativity,innuendo and muck-raking.He was at the coal face during our troubles with Madge going in hard with the hobnail boots and blaring forth about the greatest basket-case that is the WTs.He ripped hard on the Centre of Excellence cockup and has attacked,ridiculed and laughed at all and sundry on and off the field.
You’ll notice that his article is nothing more than a hatchet job à la mode FOX/Murdoch.No quotation marks,nothing from the horse’s mouth,just the same cowardly,repetitive and unaccountable guff that the likes of Buzz,Kenty and Hoops have perfected over the years.Please flush!!
No he's not. He's 95% speculative.
Nobody at Tigers has said anything about a rift and he's assuming to be upset on behalf of some Tigers staff. Don't you find it weird that he starts the article outlining how consistently Tigers lack success, then starts to assume to be upset on behalf of people directly involved in that lack of success?
It's all well and good to point the finger at Lee and Pascoe, but you also need to share some finger-pointing for Sheens, who has overseen both directly and indirectly two diabolical seasons that could well end up in 2 wooden spoons. So it may in fact be that bringing in Fulton, by any mechanism, is a good move. It may be that consulting Sheens first would have resulted in politicking or a blocking play and Fulton may have been missed out.
For all the talk of failing to get deals done, funnily enough, the signing of Scott Fulton was done very quickly and decisively. Isn't that what fans have been asking for?
My god what a load of hot garbage. Seriously. Just let Lee and Justin take the L and move on.
What is hot garbage is anybody ever saying that Paul Crawley is "100% right".
BTW I'm not defending Lee or Pascoe, I am critiquing an article by the indomitable moron Paul Crawley.
Mainstream Media Circus. Wests Tigers express interest in Sharks halfback. Following the departure of Luke Brooks for next season, the Wests Tigers are on the hunt for a new halfback.
Previously expressing interest in Manly Sea Eagles youngster Latu Fainu, Catalans Dragons veteran Mitchell Pearce and NSW Blues star Mitchell Moses, the club has now set their sights on Braydon Trindall.
Joining the Cronulla Sharks in 2018, the future looked bright for Trindall, who debuted for the club two seasons later.
The primary halfback for the backend of the 2021 season, he was unfortunately overtaken by Nicho Hynes the following year, which saw his minutes decrease as he moved to the interchange bench.
The Wests Tigers have already expressed interest in the 23-year-old, per the Sydney Morning Herald, and the race to sign him could pick up given Luke Brooks will depart the club at the end of the season.
While he isn't off-contract until the end of 2025, the Sharks are likely to offer him a release considering he won't overtake Hynes in the No.7 jersey.
Plus, the re-signing of Daniel Atkinson means he could easily enter the team if injuries occur to Hynes or Matt Moylan.
In memory of Geoff Chisholm (1965-2022)
Should Sheens & Benji been consulted beforehand? Maybe not consulted but at least informed on what management was doing. You need buy-in. The quickest way to kill an initiative is to leave people in the dark so they feel not part of the process. You often get passive resistance as a result. Many a project has gone belly up for this exact reason.Mr Creepy Crawley at it again doing his level best to destabilise and create a furore around Wests Tigers.This guy dines out on negativity,innuendo and muck-raking.He was at the coal face during our troubles with Madge going in hard with the hobnail boots and blaring forth about the greatest basket-case that is the WTs.He ripped hard on the Centre of Excellence cockup and has attacked,ridiculed and laughed at all and sundry on and off the field.
You’ll notice that his article is nothing more than a hatchet job à la mode FOX/Murdoch.No quotation marks,nothing from the horse’s mouth,just the same cowardly,repetitive and unaccountable guff that the likes of Buzz,Kenty and Hoops have perfected over the years.Please flush!!
I agree with everything you have said TS, but it is also true that the Tigers have handed the media the hatchet to bash us with. The way Fulton was appointed was ridiculous and will be ridiculed. The way that Pascoe & Lee treated Sheens and Benji was terrible and can only be justified with significant successful recruitment of quality personnel, which to date has not happened, exactly the opposite.
I am strongly of the opinion that if Fulton does not deliver Fainu (at a minimum) on a plate to the Tigers, then Fulton, Pascoe & Lee should be shown the door.
It is one thing to correctly say that the media "has it in for us" which is true, but it is an entirely other thing for Pascoe & Lee to prove them right.
Are you so sure that consulting Sheens before hiring a new recruitment manager was a better move? Are we sure that Sheens would not have attempted to block the move?
If we are in the habit of engaging in speculation, then why would Sheens be supportive of bringing in a guy to replace his preferred Head of Recruitment? And would not Sheens have been similarly defensive about his success rate in signing top-tier backs? For all we know Tigers consult Sheens, he says don't do it, they go over his head anyway, word leaks out, and we have a different but still entirely negative story about how Sheens was over-ruled (with the same outcomes - they report he is upset and considering quitting).
The stuff you say about delivering Fainu - that's a total over-reaction. I wasn't there are the interview but if we judge Scott Fulton on 6 weeks of recruitment work then we are making a grave mistake. It's not like Tigers were a dream destination before Fulton joined the club, so by what mechanism would he change that in 1.5 months? Fulton needs the same decent time to ply his craft, same as was afforded to Madge and now Sheens.
It’s called change management…
Ah but Lee never said Sheens wasn't informed, he said Sheens wasn't consulted. Big difference.
I don't know why anyone cares and seriously I don't know why I bother commenting, people drawing conclusions about office rumours is such a waste of time. I was told a very long time ago, on the other forum, that only Wins matter. Well it seems that's not true any more, it seems people are so bored they want to critique everything they think they are hearing off the field as well as actually football, does my head in. Worse over at the other forum but joining the conversation more and more over here too.
@jedi-tiger gotta say I disagree with this Jedi .
even with brooks here we couldn’t score points .
Myer our forwards are constantly putting us in great attacking positions and our backs have shown when given the right ball and time , they can really do damage . If at the moment only in small spurts .I would be selling him on this fact , the fact we have the pigs in place . We have the backs in place , and now we need a spark plug .
Just my two centsat present wakeham is the 7 we haven't signed anything else, we can say we are looking at trindall but at present it is wakeham.
track record no Moses,Pearce, Johnson and Brooks gone we don't exactly have a stellar record in recruitment
Or he can head to dolphins and be coached by bennet
we should have had this locked up already
He was only given permission to negotiate last week?
The urgency is unwarranted. I understand Tigers are not travelling well, but they were given permission to negotiate 5 days ago, and people are complaining that the deal isn't done yet. Nothing gets done in 5 days, as per these photos, they probably haven't even managed to find a good time for the Tigers and players to meet before now.
@jedi-tiger gotta say I disagree with this Jedi .
even with brooks here we couldn’t score points .
Myer our forwards are constantly putting us in great attacking positions and our backs have shown when given the right ball and time , they can really do damage . If at the moment only in small spurts .I would be selling him on this fact , the fact we have the pigs in place . We have the backs in place , and now we need a spark plug .
Just my two centsat present wakeham is the 7 we haven't signed anything else, we can say we are looking at trindall but at present it is wakeham.
track record no Moses,Pearce, Johnson and Brooks gone we don't exactly have a stellar record in recruitment
Or he can head to dolphins and be coached by bennet
we should have had this locked up already
He was only given permission to negotiate last week?
The urgency is unwarranted. I understand Tigers are not travelling well, but they were given permission to negotiate 5 days ago, and people are complaining that the deal isn't done yet. Nothing gets done in 5 days, as per these photos, they probably haven't even managed to find a good time for the Tigers and players to meet before now.
they have known Fulton and tartak knows benji, I am sure conversations had been had prior to 5 days ago.
Typical tigers like JAC negotiations and Moses negotiations we always seem disorganised
@jedi-tiger gotta say I disagree with this Jedi .
even with brooks here we couldn’t score points .
Myer our forwards are constantly putting us in great attacking positions and our backs have shown when given the right ball and time , they can really do damage . If at the moment only in small spurts .I would be selling him on this fact , the fact we have the pigs in place . We have the backs in place , and now we need a spark plug .
Just my two centsat present wakeham is the 7 we haven't signed anything else, we can say we are looking at trindall but at present it is wakeham.
track record no Moses,Pearce, Johnson and Brooks gone we don't exactly have a stellar record in recruitment
Or he can head to dolphins and be coached by bennet
we should have had this locked up already
He was only given permission to negotiate last week?
The urgency is unwarranted. I understand Tigers are not travelling well, but they were given permission to negotiate 5 days ago, and people are complaining that the deal isn't done yet. Nothing gets done in 5 days, as per these photos, they probably haven't even managed to find a good time for the Tigers and players to meet before now.
Two things can be true at once. Yes he was only given permission to negotiate 5 days ago, but that was obviously as a result of unofficial negotiations prior so they should not be starting from scratch.
Urgency is warranted 100%. There are 16 other clubs constantly working on their squads for next year and I can think of 3 or 4 clubs that need to strengthen their halves, but I can think of only 1 club that has zero healthy halves Contracted for 2024, which starts in 126 days. Sure we can take our time, but its unlikely that Titans, Dolphins, Raiders, Bulldogs will.
Mr Creepy Crawley at it again doing his level best to destabilise and create a furore around Wests Tigers.This guy dines out on negativity,innuendo and muck-raking.He was at the coal face during our troubles with Madge going in hard with the hobnail boots and blaring forth about the greatest basket-case that is the WTs.He ripped hard on the Centre of Excellence cockup and has attacked,ridiculed and laughed at all and sundry on and off the field.
You’ll notice that his article is nothing more than a hatchet job à la mode FOX/Murdoch.No quotation marks,nothing from the horse’s mouth,just the same cowardly,repetitive and unaccountable guff that the likes of Buzz,Kenty and Hoops have perfected over the years.Please flush!!
I agree with everything you have said TS, but it is also true that the Tigers have handed the media the hatchet to bash us with. The way Fulton was appointed was ridiculous and will be ridiculed. The way that Pascoe & Lee treated Sheens and Benji was terrible and can only be justified with significant successful recruitment of quality personnel, which to date has not happened, exactly the opposite.
I am strongly of the opinion that if Fulton does not deliver Fainu (at a minimum) on a plate to the Tigers, then Fulton, Pascoe & Lee should be shown the door.
It is one thing to correctly say that the media "has it in for us" which is true, but it is an entirely other thing for Pascoe & Lee to prove them right.
Are you so sure that consulting Sheens before hiring a new recruitment manager was a better move? Are we sure that Sheens would not have attempted to block the move?
If we are in the habit of engaging in speculation, then why would Sheens be supportive of bringing in a guy to replace his preferred Head of Recruitment? And would not Sheens have been similarly defensive about his success rate in signing top-tier backs? For all we know Tigers consult Sheens, he says don't do it, they go over his head anyway, word leaks out, and we have a different but still entirely negative story about how Sheens was over-ruled (with the same outcomes - they report he is upset and considering quitting).
The stuff you say about delivering Fainu - that's a total over-reaction. I wasn't there are the interview but if we judge Scott Fulton on 6 weeks of recruitment work then we are making a grave mistake. It's not like Tigers were a dream destination before Fulton joined the club, so by what mechanism would he change that in 1.5 months? Fulton needs the same decent time to ply his craft, same as was afforded to Madge and now Sheens.
I can follow your logic with regards not consulting Sheens and for the purposes of the discussion, lets say it was a sound idea (arguable). By its definition (not consulting/secret because Sheens would disagree) it is unavoidable that it is going to cause conflict with the coach of the team. That is unavoidable and unarguable. Are we in such a strong position on and off the field that we can intentionally disrupt trust between management and the coach?
I get your argument and the logic behind it, but ultimately its a consideration of whether the intentional disruption of trust is worth it and a good idea. What is the payoff? That is why the pressure is and should be on fulton because otherwise it is all negative disruption with no payoff and that is madness, particularly at our fragile state.
Management (pascoe and lee by their own statements) have made a massive decision with this and IMO they should be judged on the results. Easy to argue that 6 weeks isnt a long time, but Fainu is available now and wont be in 2 months. Fulton has everything supposedly in his favour to make this deal and if he doesnt, I fear for future deals. If we dont go into 2024 preseason with two decent halves, then it is a failure and Pascoe & Lee should be judged on it.
OK - but first hold off all criticism until Fainu signs or does not. Then judge whether or not Fulton can provide a long-term recruitment strategy (and success) as he has done for Manly.
As I said slightly earlier, I'm not really interested in speculating what happened behind the scenes, I was only trying to hose down some of the alarm and fixation on signing Fainu as a non-negotiable necessity and people getting upset about what they heard about they way things went down. It's become so much like a soap opera, people worried about feelings and what they think they heard in the media, and I'm considering just not commenting at all rather than trying to argue for some calm or dissociation from the issue.
@tiger5150 Crawley leads his article with,‘Rumblings of unrest’,and ‘Simmering Bad Blood’,and then,’Will Benji Walk?’.My sole gripe is that this is pure speculation Crawley is framing as fact. A journalist worth his salt will delve a lot deeper than his stilted insinuations and provide substance rather than aerated fluff.
This is the same outfit that brought us the completely broken down relationship of Benji and Robbie that was kept on “simmer”for years but was absolute BS. Crawley is stirring the pot and in quest of clicks.
Thats fine, Im not defending Crawley who is a hack journalist. My point is that whilst his article might be largely speculation, it is speculation based on fact. Pascoe & Lee DID (by their own admission) go behind their coach's back to appoint someone to replace someone that the coach appointed. That is a fact. Now you could argue like Jirskyr has above that this was a good idea, but it is a fact and by its definition it does disrupt the trust between management and the coaching staff so then the question is, is the pay off worth the disruption to the harmony in the club? Time will tell but IMO we are running out of time and at present it is heading in a very concerning direction.
Again IMO to make the disruption worth it, at a minimum Fulton has to deliver L Fainu.
Ah just a point of correction - I did not argue it was a "good idea", I suggested there could be legitimate reasons why Sheens was not consulted beforehand. My point has always been that you can judge the success or error of such a decision by the ultimate outcome (signings and what the Head Coaches do), but 6 weeks on from the Fulton signing is too early to make any such call.
And anyone saying the success/failure of recruiting Scott Fulton rests 100% on the signature of a kid from Manly - well I think they are being hysterical.
Fulton needs the same decent time to ply his craft, same as was afforded to Madge and now Sheens.
Fulton does not have that time. In 126 days Wests Tigers commence their preseason with zero healthy contracted halves. Not one, although Im sure if we asked nicely Wakeham and Will Smith would hang around. Fulton does not have time. That is not his fault, that is Pascoe and Lee's fault 100%. Doesnt matter, Fulton needs to perform, now otherwise the club will live with the consequences of their decisions.
I agree he doesn't have a lot of time, but you don't sack him because of a situation the club created.
@tiger5150 Have faith I know where your coming from ,I get that feeling but I will put my confidence in the new guy as the regurgitated part of the organisation is just not up to it .. change has happened Brooks has gone a new recruitment guy that by all accounts is good at what he does has arrived , Rome was not built in a day . I for one will give him time to get his hands dirty .I am pretty positive about what has developed a new dawn just might be around the corner!
if Fulton misses his target in Fainu given his manly connections, then he should be punted him along with Lee and Justin
No. Take a few deep breaths.
I agree he doesn't have a lot of time, but you don't sack him because of a situation the club created.
That depends on what he was stating as a timeline when he was appointed.
In memory of Geoff Chisholm (1965-2022)
Fulton needs the same decent time to ply his craft, same as was afforded to Madge and now Sheens.
Fulton does not have that time. In 126 days Wests Tigers commence their preseason with zero healthy contracted halves. Not one, although Im sure if we asked nicely Wakeham and Will Smith would hang around. Fulton does not have time. That is not his fault, that is Pascoe and Lee's fault 100%. Doesnt matter, Fulton needs to perform, now otherwise the club will live with the consequences of their decisions.
I agree he doesn't have a lot of time, but you don't sack him because of a situation the club created.
No I'd sack Pascoe and Lee for creating the situation. Fulton would be pretty much a dead duck without them though.
No I'd sack Pascoe and Lee for creating the situation. Fulton would be pretty much a dead duck without them though.
Lee and Pascoe will be gone in 18months if they can’t get the roster right by then
Pascoe is the Luke Brooks of admin
Nice guy but doesn't know how to win
It's time to shake hands and go out separate ways
Top 8 2023
Pascoe is the Luke Brooks of admin
Nice guy but doesn't know how to win
It's time to shake hands and go out separate ways
Good comparison, accurate
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