If you read an earlier post from me I put Nikora as one of two players I’d love to have at the club 2026. The reason I mentioned Wilton as part of a swap deal is that I know the Sharks would want to keep Nikora more than Wilton & Wilton has a connection with Morris. I no point did I suggest Wilton is better than Nikora, in fact Nikora, as you know, is in the best 2 or 3 edge backrowers in the game. I’d even think of shifting Samuela back to the pack if we could get Nikora & we couldn’t get a better middle. Would lose nothing on that edge & Samuela could be a gun prop if given time there. I very much doubt any of this will happen, the swap or Nikora coming here but they’re things I’d like to see happen, just ideas throwing up for discussion more than anything.I’m not sure if this kind of thing is allowed under the anti-tampering laws but I wonder if the Tigers have thought of going to the Sharks & offering them Bateman at say $350,000 the next 2 years. And asking if they’d be willing to release Wilton to us, we pay full freight for him, probably around $400,000 next year. We could incentivise the deal for Wilton by offering him maybe $500,000 the following 2 years. It would free up a little money for the Sharks enabling them to maybe keep one of their star players who can talk to other clubs Nov.
And a Sharks pack of:
AFB
Brayley
Kaufusi
Nikora
Bateman
McInnessis still a strong pack.
Why muck around with Wilton when Nikora is off Contract at the same time? Id love the Tigers to have a BIG go at Nikora. He is exactly what we need (after buying one or two props).
not having a crack at you Russ but your post IMO sums up a historical problem with the Tigers of confidence. Nikora and Wilton are both as available as each other. Cronulla have let both of them get to Nov 1. Club should puff their chest out, put their hand in their pocket and prioritise Nikora, think like the Roosters, THINK like a successful club. Not think "Oh i dont think we could get the good one, lets go for the second best."
All good but what I have never stated is “don’t bother with Nikora”. By all means have a crack at him come November & I hope it pays off but do I think it will? No. To have Samuela & Nikora on the edges would be a dream come true. But I believe the Sharks will do all they can to keep him, he’ll be a priority for them. And if you miss out on him it’s unlikely you will land Wilton. Will Tieg be a priority? He will be less of a priority than Nikora. Will he be cheaper? Yes, potentially giving you more to have a crack at Davvy Moale or Tallis Duncan etc. Does Tieg have a connection at the Tigers? Yes. Is he a good player with plenty of upside? Yes. But if we have a crack at Nikora & fail, and we’ve failed previously, we probably lose the opportunity to land Wilton. It’s just a choice based upon probability.If you read an earlier post from me I put Nikora as one of two players I’d love to have at the club 2026. The reason I mentioned Wilton as part of a swap deal is that I know the Sharks would want to keep Nikora more than Wilton & Wilton has a connection with Morris. I no point did I suggest Wilton is better than Nikora, in fact Nikora, as you know, is in the best 2 or 3 edge backrowers in the game. I’d even think of shifting Samuela back to the pack if we could get Nikora & we couldn’t get a better middle. Would lose nothing on that edge & Samuela could be a gun prop if given time there. I very much doubt any of this will happen, the swap or Nikora coming here but they’re things I’d like to see happen, just ideas throwing up for discussion more than anything.I’m not sure if this kind of thing is allowed under the anti-tampering laws but I wonder if the Tigers have thought of going to the Sharks & offering them Bateman at say $350,000 the next 2 years. And asking if they’d be willing to release Wilton to us, we pay full freight for him, probably around $400,000 next year. We could incentivise the deal for Wilton by offering him maybe $500,000 the following 2 years. It would free up a little money for the Sharks enabling them to maybe keep one of their star players who can talk to other clubs Nov.
And a Sharks pack of:
AFB
Brayley
Kaufusi
Nikora
Bateman
McInnessis still a strong pack.
Why muck around with Wilton when Nikora is off Contract at the same time? Id love the Tigers to have a BIG go at Nikora. He is exactly what we need (after buying one or two props).
not having a crack at you Russ but your post IMO sums up a historical problem with the Tigers of confidence. Nikora and Wilton are both as available as each other. Cronulla have let both of them get to Nov 1. Club should puff their chest out, put their hand in their pocket and prioritise Nikora, think like the Roosters, THINK like a successful club. Not think "Oh i dont think we could get the good one, lets go for the second best."
It’s a difficult one. I think not every young guy we bring through into NRL will be very good players, some will simply be squad players, depth players on that minimum-$300,000 which every club needs. They’ll be needed occasionally but not a lot. Some of them we bring through will be consistent NRL players & a few will be top class. I guess the issue is surrounding those top class guys with as many good players as your cap allows. Personally, I think we only need one very good middle and edge. But that also depends upon the retention of a few guys.How much more external recruitment do we need? Surely guys like Matamua, Faagatu and Kit L are future NRL players? Otherwise, why are we persisting with them?
@russtutty63 but we have too many young players. It's crazy.
Matamua - I can see him playing 200 games at another club. We've straight out butchered his development. I hope he is still with us in 2025 but it must be unlikely. Has always dominated reggies but never got NRL minutes on a consistent level.
Kit Laulilii - not big enough for the NRL. Modern day Brendan Santi in my opinion.
Faagutu - injured for large chunks of last year. Managed by Isaac Moses and in his final contract year. He'll be on the move to an Isaac-aligned club soon enough.
Kids are great but this is a professional sport. You can’t expect 18/20 year olds fresh out of school to out perform seasoned professionals. This is particularly a problem in the forwards where it’s typically the first time talented junior forwards have come up against men that have been training and hardening for several years. We need seasoned forwards to give our kids some protection and a chance to show what spent they have.
Kids are great but this is a professional sport. You can’t expect 18/20 year olds fresh out of school to out perform seasoned professionals. This is particularly a problem in the forwards where it’s typically the first time talented junior forwards have come up against men that have been training and hardening for several years. We need seasoned forwards to give our kids some protection and a chance to show what spent they have.
Yes, but you also can’t block their path. Really difficult balancing act.
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Yep, some won’t make it and some will be moved on but there are very few players who make it at 19 especially forwards. Most debut at 20 or 21. Kit is same size as Cotter, he won’t be as good as him but he could still be a good NRL player. Cotter made 5 appearances as a 19 year old and 16 more over the following 2 years. it wasn’t really until he was 22 that he found his level that he is now. I’m just using him as a comparison. Unfortunately for the Tigers we are impatient because we’re coming off such a low base, we want to see something good now. If we don’t we don’t think they could still develop into a good player so move them on. Let’s see what some of these guys can do this year then make a judgement, let them develop some more.@russtutty63 but we have too many young players. It's crazy.
Matamua - I can see him playing 200 games at another club. We've straight out butchered his development. I hope he is still with us in 2025 but it must be unlikely. Has always dominated reggies but never got NRL minutes on a consistent level.
Kit Laulilii - not big enough for the NRL. Modern day Brendan Santi in my opinion.
Faagutu - injured for large chunks of last year. Managed by Isaac Moses and in his final contract year. He'll be on the move to an Isaac-aligned club soon enough.
How much more external recruitment do we need? Surely guys like Matamua, Faagatu and Kit L are future NRL players? Otherwise, why are we persisting with them?
Because they have contracts, we need external recruitment, we ran last the last 3 years.
In memory of Geoff Chisholm (1965-2022)
Yep, some won’t make it and some will be moved on but there are very few players who make it at 19 especially forwards. Most debut at 20 or 21. Kit is same size as Cotter, he won’t be as good as him but he could still be a good NRL player. Cotter made 5 appearances as a 19 year old and 16 more over the following 2 years. it wasn’t really until he was 22 that he found his level that he is now. I’m just using him as a comparison. Unfortunately for the Tigers we are impatient because we’re coming off such a low base, we want to see something good now. If we don’t we don’t think they could still develop into a good player so move them on. Let’s see what some of these guys can do this year then make a judgement, let them develop some more.@russtutty63 but we have too many young players. It's crazy.
Matamua - I can see him playing 200 games at another club. We've straight out butchered his development. I hope he is still with us in 2025 but it must be unlikely. Has always dominated reggies but never got NRL minutes on a consistent level.
Kit Laulilii - not big enough for the NRL. Modern day Brendan Santi in my opinion.
Faagutu - injured for large chunks of last year. Managed by Isaac Moses and in his final contract year. He'll be on the move to an Isaac-aligned club soon enough.
I wouldn't call it impatience, this club simply can't continue to run last. the improvement needs to start now. At this point we have too many kids in our squad. We also have too many players that you would like falling into the lower section of your squad in our top 20 players.
In memory of Geoff Chisholm (1965-2022)
I’m not sure what too many is or too little or how many is a good number. But you’re right in that the top 20 should consist of genuine 1st grade talent. How many kids are in our top 20? I don’t know, would assume Galvin, Luke L, Latu & TDS. I guess Sam could also be put in that category. Not a bad bunch to be honest. There are probably another 5 or 6 outside that top 20 who still yet to earn their stripes, still very much in that development phase. We are a development club, or in the process of becoming one as it’s our only way of achieving sustained success, but because of the lack of success we need it now. If you have a top 24 or 25 that are genuine 1st grade talent then having 5 or 6 twenty year olds on minimum isn’t such a bad thing. It’s those 25 players who will play the majority of games. The trick is getting the best 24 or 25 you can. It’s actually the Batemans, Sullivan, Nadens etc, the supposedly genuine NRL talent that underperforms that is more the issue.Yep, some won’t make it and some will be moved on but there are very few players who make it at 19 especially forwards. Most debut at 20 or 21. Kit is same size as Cotter, he won’t be as good as him but he could still be a good NRL player. Cotter made 5 appearances as a 19 year old and 16 more over the following 2 years. it wasn’t really until he was 22 that he found his level that he is now. I’m just using him as a comparison. Unfortunately for the Tigers we are impatient because we’re coming off such a low base, we want to see something good now. If we don’t we don’t think they could still develop into a good player so move them on. Let’s see what some of these guys can do this year then make a judgement, let them develop some more.@russtutty63 but we have too many young players. It's crazy.
Matamua - I can see him playing 200 games at another club. We've straight out butchered his development. I hope he is still with us in 2025 but it must be unlikely. Has always dominated reggies but never got NRL minutes on a consistent level.
Kit Laulilii - not big enough for the NRL. Modern day Brendan Santi in my opinion.
Faagutu - injured for large chunks of last year. Managed by Isaac Moses and in his final contract year. He'll be on the move to an Isaac-aligned club soon enough.
I wouldn't call it impatience, this club simply can't continue to run last. the improvement needs to start now. At this point we have too many kids in our squad. We also have too many players that you would like falling into the lower section of your squad in our top 20 players.
I just had a Quick Look at the Panthers this season. They used 31 players but 7 of them played a total of 14 games. So the other 24 played the majority. 7 of the 33 used by the Storm played a total of 10 games. I should imagine it’d be the same for the majority of clubs. In my opinion it’s that top 20-25 that you need to get right.I’m not sure what too many is or too little or how many is a good number. But you’re right in that the top 20 should consist of genuine 1st grade talent. How many kids are in our top 20? I don’t know, would assume Galvin, Luke L, Latu & TDS. I guess Sam could also be put in that category. Not a bad bunch to be honest. There are probably another 5 or 6 outside that top 20 who still yet to earn their stripes, still very much in that development phase. We are a development club, or in the process of becoming one as it’s our only way of achieving sustained success, but because of the lack of success we need it now. If you have a top 24 or 25 that are genuine 1st grade talent then having 5 or 6 twenty year olds on minimum isn’t such a bad thing. It’s those 25 players who will play the majority of games. The trick is getting the best 24 or 25 you can. It’s actually the Batemans, Sullivan, Nadens etc, the supposedly genuine NRL talent that underperforms that is more the issue.Yep, some won’t make it and some will be moved on but there are very few players who make it at 19 especially forwards. Most debut at 20 or 21. Kit is same size as Cotter, he won’t be as good as him but he could still be a good NRL player. Cotter made 5 appearances as a 19 year old and 16 more over the following 2 years. it wasn’t really until he was 22 that he found his level that he is now. I’m just using him as a comparison. Unfortunately for the Tigers we are impatient because we’re coming off such a low base, we want to see something good now. If we don’t we don’t think they could still develop into a good player so move them on. Let’s see what some of these guys can do this year then make a judgement, let them develop some more.@russtutty63 but we have too many young players. It's crazy.
Matamua - I can see him playing 200 games at another club. We've straight out butchered his development. I hope he is still with us in 2025 but it must be unlikely. Has always dominated reggies but never got NRL minutes on a consistent level.
Kit Laulilii - not big enough for the NRL. Modern day Brendan Santi in my opinion.
Faagutu - injured for large chunks of last year. Managed by Isaac Moses and in his final contract year. He'll be on the move to an Isaac-aligned club soon enough.
I wouldn't call it impatience, this club simply can't continue to run last. the improvement needs to start now. At this point we have too many kids in our squad. We also have too many players that you would like falling into the lower section of your squad in our top 20 players.
I’m not sure what too many is or too little or how many is a good number. But you’re right in that the top 20 should consist of genuine 1st grade talent. How many kids are in our top 20? I don’t know, would assume Galvin, Luke L, Latu & TDS. I guess Sam could also be put in that category. Not a bad bunch to be honest. There are probably another 5 or 6 outside that top 20 who still yet to earn their stripes, still very much in that development phase. We are a development club, or in the process of becoming one as it’s our only way of achieving sustained success, but because of the lack of success we need it now. If you have a top 24 or 25 that are genuine 1st grade talent then having 5 or 6 twenty year olds on minimum isn’t such a bad thing. It’s those 25 players who will play the majority of games. The trick is getting the best 24 or 25 you can. It’s actually the Batemans, Sullivan, Nadens etc, the supposedly genuine NRL talent that underperforms that is more the issue.Yep, some won’t make it and some will be moved on but there are very few players who make it at 19 especially forwards. Most debut at 20 or 21. Kit is same size as Cotter, he won’t be as good as him but he could still be a good NRL player. Cotter made 5 appearances as a 19 year old and 16 more over the following 2 years. it wasn’t really until he was 22 that he found his level that he is now. I’m just using him as a comparison. Unfortunately for the Tigers we are impatient because we’re coming off such a low base, we want to see something good now. If we don’t we don’t think they could still develop into a good player so move them on. Let’s see what some of these guys can do this year then make a judgement, let them develop some more.@russtutty63 but we have too many young players. It's crazy.
Matamua - I can see him playing 200 games at another club. We've straight out butchered his development. I hope he is still with us in 2025 but it must be unlikely. Has always dominated reggies but never got NRL minutes on a consistent level.
Kit Laulilii - not big enough for the NRL. Modern day Brendan Santi in my opinion.
Faagutu - injured for large chunks of last year. Managed by Isaac Moses and in his final contract year. He'll be on the move to an Isaac-aligned club soon enough.
I wouldn't call it impatience, this club simply can't continue to run last. the improvement needs to start now. At this point we have too many kids in our squad. We also have too many players that you would like falling into the lower section of your squad in our top 20 players.
Chris Faagutu, Josh Feledy, Kit Laulilii, Justin Matamua, Jordan Miller, Solomone Saukuru, Tony Sukkar and Brandon Tumeth are all guys we have in our top 30 that were upgraded too early and are limiting our ability to upgrade our squad. A lot of these guys had automatic upgrades to top 30 written into their junior contracts.
Adam Doueihi, Brent Naden, Alex Seyfarth, Charlie Staines, Starford To'a and Alex Twal are all guys you would like to see in your 20-25
Then you have guys like Jayden Sullivan and John Bateman who you don't want in first grade.
These are all guys you only want called on when injuries hit, I'm maybe being a little harsh on Seyfarth so outside of him that is 15 players in your top 30 you want having minimal involvement in your season. We can't even field a 17 without using those players.
You also have players like Klemm (nearing the end) Olam and Bird (both have serious injury doubts.
Our top 30 is severely unbalanced and we need to move some of these players on to improve the squad.
I hate to say it by @avo is right, we should never have extended Toa and Twal, these decisions are biting us now.
In memory of Geoff Chisholm (1965-2022)
I also didn't include Tallyn Da Silva, Latu Fainu, Lachlan Galvin and Luke Laulilii in the list as they are all junior players I expect to have an impact on the 2025 season.
So that is 12 players on their first NRL contract in our top 30, many of them teenagers.
Yes we are a development club but it is obvious we have just given them all contracts instead of being selective in the ones we have targeted. I am sure we have another 3 0r 4 guys that will automatically upgrade to top 30 spots in 2026 and keep us in a position that makes recruiting for the outside help our genuinely young stars need.
In memory of Geoff Chisholm (1965-2022)
Please please please
In memory of Geoff Chisholm (1965-2022)
