I think Lee and Pascoe confuse responsibility and accountability. They are both absolutely responsible for the mess we are in but not accountable to anyone other than their own self serving interests.
I think Lee and Pascoe confuse responsibility and accountability. They are both absolutely responsible for the mess we are in but not accountable to anyone other than their own self serving interests.
What structure would you like to see for the board Mike?
In memory of Geoff Chisholm (1965-2022)
There are better ways of doing things though as well. It's interesting that a number of points from the pod and forum were raised in that article.Lee is echoing a lot of what Garry has been saying on the pods re: populism not being a great thing either, which I absolutely agree with.
The rest of his quotes are confusing tbh.
Agree. It's not a black & white situation (though it kinda is given its a Wests Ashfield thing).
Actually I’d like the board of Holman Barnes Group to be separated from the Wests Tigers Football Club Pty Ltd with initially independent board members appointed for a staggered fix term only. I think fixed terms, maybe 4 years with a maximum of two 4 year terms, are the way to go to ensure new blood and new ideas constantly feed into the executive (board) level. I like your ideas. I especially like that a seperate executive recruitment organisation be responsible for headhunting and recruitment of suitable people for the Board. There probably needs to be a mixture of those with a football background and those from a corporate background. Probably a max number of 9 including the Chairperson in the Board.I think Lee and Pascoe confuse responsibility and accountability. They are both absolutely responsible for the mess we are in but not accountable to anyone other than their own self serving interests.
What structure would you like to see for the board Mike?
At the ‘C’ level I think that we need a CEO for overall responsibility of the club and its performance both on an off the field. A COO to ensure operations of the club performs well off the field and we don’t see the stuff ups like we do with the current situation where the CEO does everything. Then of course a Head of Football responsible for everything to do with on field performance. A CFO responsible for the finances of the organisation. The COO, CFO and Head of Football report to the CEO. The CEO reports to the board. The CEO could be directly responsible for sponsorship recruitment and retention as well as lobbying government for favourable grants. Additionally of course the CEO would be responsible for the development and implementing the Strategic Plan in association with the Board.
Edit: And the Chairperson should not be a Sponsor, major or otherwise.
Actually I’d like the board of Holman Barnes Group to be separated from the Wests Tigers Football Club Pty Ltd with initially independent board members appointed for a staggered fix term only. I think fixed terms, maybe 4 years with a maximum of two 4 year terms, are the way to go to ensure new blood and new ideas constantly feed into the executive (board) level. I like your ideas. I especially like that a seperate executive recruitment organisation be responsible for headhunting and recruitment of suitable people for the Board. There probably needs to be a mixture of those with a football background and those from a corporate background. Probably a max number of 9 including the Chairperson in the Board.I think Lee and Pascoe confuse responsibility and accountability. They are both absolutely responsible for the mess we are in but not accountable to anyone other than their own self serving interests.
What structure would you like to see for the board Mike?
At the ‘C’ level I think that we need a CEO for overall responsibility of the club and its performance both on an off the field. A COO to ensure operations of the club performs well off the field and we don’t see the stuff ups like we do with the current situation where the CEO does everything. Then of course a Head of Football responsible for everything to do with on field performance. A CFO responsible for the finances of the organisation. The COO, CFO and Head of Football report to the CEO. The CEO reports to the board. The CEO could be directly responsible for sponsorship recruitment and retention as well as lobbying government for favourable grants. Additionally of course the CEO would be responsible for the development and implementing the Strategic Plan in association with the Board.
Edit: And the Chairperson should not be a Sponsor, major or otherwise.
this seems like a fairly logical corporate structure. If I was to pin point what is going wrong at the moment it is that we effectively have an executive chairman ie a chairman who wants to involve himself in the day to day operations of the organisation rather than serving as an over sight function. Regardless of whether Lee is qualified to serve as chairman (I think he basically doesn’t have the skills), organisations run into trouble when there are not clear roles and accountabilities. By involving himself in football matters (recruitment/media etc) he cannot be objective about the performance of the organisation because he is complicit. Ultimately, Wests Ashfield is to blame for enacting the corporate structure that Wests Tigers operates under and as an anarchic Leagues Club they would have no idea what good corporate governance looks like.
Actually I’d like the board of Holman Barnes Group to be separated from the Wests Tigers Football Club Pty Ltd with initially independent board members appointed for a staggered fix term only. I think fixed terms, maybe 4 years with a maximum of two 4 year terms, are the way to go to ensure new blood and new ideas constantly feed into the executive (board) level. I like your ideas. I especially like that a seperate executive recruitment organisation be responsible for headhunting and recruitment of suitable people for the Board. There probably needs to be a mixture of those with a football background and those from a corporate background. Probably a max number of 9 including the Chairperson in the Board.I think Lee and Pascoe confuse responsibility and accountability. They are both absolutely responsible for the mess we are in but not accountable to anyone other than their own self serving interests.
What structure would you like to see for the board Mike?
At the ‘C’ level I think that we need a CEO for overall responsibility of the club and its performance both on an off the field. A COO to ensure operations of the club performs well off the field and we don’t see the stuff ups like we do with the current situation where the CEO does everything. Then of course a Head of Football responsible for everything to do with on field performance. A CFO responsible for the finances of the organisation. The COO, CFO and Head of Football report to the CEO. The CEO reports to the board. The CEO could be directly responsible for sponsorship recruitment and retention as well as lobbying government for favourable grants. Additionally of course the CEO would be responsible for the development and implementing the Strategic Plan in association with the Board.
Edit: And the Chairperson should not be a Sponsor, major or otherwise.
Some good points Mike, but the flaw is that Wests Tigers Football Club is a seperate company to WA/HBG. No owner of any private company is ever going to agree to having a totally independent board that is independent of the owner and capital and this is also not desirable because it is instable. IMO the board should be changed to a majority WA/HBG, one Balmain seat and the balance actually independednt and as you say appointed via targeted recruitment.
Actually I’d like the board of Holman Barnes Group to be separated from the Wests Tigers Football Club Pty Ltd with initially independent board members appointed for a staggered fix term only. I think fixed terms, maybe 4 years with a maximum of two 4 year terms, are the way to go to ensure new blood and new ideas constantly feed into the executive (board) level. I like your ideas. I especially like that a seperate executive recruitment organisation be responsible for headhunting and recruitment of suitable people for the Board. There probably needs to be a mixture of those with a football background and those from a corporate background. Probably a max number of 9 including the Chairperson in the Board.I think Lee and Pascoe confuse responsibility and accountability. They are both absolutely responsible for the mess we are in but not accountable to anyone other than their own self serving interests.
What structure would you like to see for the board Mike?
At the ‘C’ level I think that we need a CEO for overall responsibility of the club and its performance both on an off the field. A COO to ensure operations of the club performs well off the field and we don’t see the stuff ups like we do with the current situation where the CEO does everything. Then of course a Head of Football responsible for everything to do with on field performance. A CFO responsible for the finances of the organisation. The COO, CFO and Head of Football report to the CEO. The CEO reports to the board. The CEO could be directly responsible for sponsorship recruitment and retention as well as lobbying government for favourable grants. Additionally of course the CEO would be responsible for the development and implementing the Strategic Plan in association with the Board.
Edit: And the Chairperson should not be a Sponsor, major or otherwise.
this seems like a fairly logical corporate structure.
Except that it cedes governance to someone other than the owner/capital. That is not a logical corporate structure nor is it a sensible one. WA will/should maintain a majority on the board. IMO what needs to change is the independence of the the balance of the seats (except maybe one for Balmain for old times sake) and also IMO WA need to have a hard look at hwo they appoint in their majority seats.
I understand that which is why I think the NRL should step in. If I recall correctly something similar happened at the Eels with racing & gaming stepping in and forcing independence of the football club from the Parramatta leagues club. Since that happened the Eels football club has improved greatly, making the grand final last year.Some good points Mike, but the flaw is that Wests Tigers Football Club is a seperate company to WA/HBG. No owner of any private company is ever going to agree to having a totally independent board that is independent of the owner and capital and this is also not desirable because it is instable. IMO the board should be changed to a majority WA/HBG, one Balmain seat and the balance actually independednt and as you say appointed via targeted recruitment.
I understand that which is why I think the NRL should step in. If I recall correctly something similar happened at the Eels with racing & gaming stepping in and forcing independence of the football club from the Parramatta leagues club. Since that happened the Eels football club has improved greatly, making the grand final last year.
I believe they stepped in at Parramatta because they were operating illegally.
In memory of Geoff Chisholm (1965-2022)
I understand that which is why I think the NRL should step in. If I recall correctly something similar happened at the Eels with racing & gaming stepping in and forcing independence of the football club from the Parramatta leagues club. Since that happened the Eels football club has improved greatly, making the grand final last year.Some good points Mike, but the flaw is that Wests Tigers Football Club is a seperate company to WA/HBG. No owner of any private company is ever going to agree to having a totally independent board that is independent of the owner and capital and this is also not desirable because it is instable. IMO the board should be changed to a majority WA/HBG, one Balmain seat and the balance actually independednt and as you say appointed via targeted recruitment.
NRL cant step in. Racing and gaming will only step in if laws or governance regulations are broken. Wests Ashfield and Parra Leagues are licensed clubs which operate under massive tax advantages supposedly for the community advantage and OLGA (racing and gaming) watch them all like a hawk. My recollection of the issue with Parra was it was the same board (not the same at Tigers)
Thanks for that regarding the Eels, clarifying that situation.I understand that which is why I think the NRL should step in. If I recall correctly something similar happened at the Eels with racing & gaming stepping in and forcing independence of the football club from the Parramatta leagues club. Since that happened the Eels football club has improved greatly, making the grand final last year.Some good points Mike, but the flaw is that Wests Tigers Football Club is a seperate company to WA/HBG. No owner of any private company is ever going to agree to having a totally independent board that is independent of the owner and capital and this is also not desirable because it is instable. IMO the board should be changed to a majority WA/HBG, one Balmain seat and the balance actually independednt and as you say appointed via targeted recruitment.
NRL cant step in. Racing and gaming will only step in if laws or governance regulations are broken. Wests Ashfield and Parra Leagues are licensed clubs which operate under massive tax advantages supposedly for the community advantage and OLGA (racing and gaming) watch them all like a hawk. My recollection of the issue with Parra was it was the same board (not the same at Tigers)
Not that I am expecting anything to actually happen but surely the NRL can step in as they issue the licence and hold the Wests Tigers trade mark.
NRL cant step in. Racing and gaming will only step in if laws or governance regulations are broken. Wests Ashfield and Parra Leagues are licensed clubs which operate under massive tax advantages supposedly for the community advantage and OLGA (racing and gaming) watch them all like a hawk. My recollection of the issue with Parra was it was the same board (not the same at Tigers)
From memory I believe that there were financial irregularities that led to them changing the governance structure of the clubs. I think they were paying trades for work that wasn't completely and those trades were then sponsoring players to those values. It was a couple of years ago now so I might be mistaken but that is my understanding of the situation.
In memory of Geoff Chisholm (1965-2022)
NRL cant step in. Racing and gaming will only step in if laws or governance regulations are broken. Wests Ashfield and Parra Leagues are licensed clubs which operate under massive tax advantages supposedly for the community advantage and OLGA (racing and gaming) watch them all like a hawk. My recollection of the issue with Parra was it was the same board (not the same at Tigers)
From memory I believe that there were financial irregularities that led to them changing the governance structure of the clubs. I think they were paying trades for work that wasn't completely and those trades were then sponsoring players to those values. It was a couple of years ago now so I might be mistaken but that is my understanding of the situation.
I think you are right.
Years ago I was involved in upgrades to Balmain Leagues and Canterbury Leagues. This was the time immediately before the NSW Govt introduced the Pokie tax to leagues clubs and leagues club were making obscene money and flew my colleagues (not me unfortuantely) to Las Vegas to scope the best ideas to steal. Thats when we installed that fake horse racing game at Balmain Leagues and it was also around the time of the proposed Oasis at Liverpool. Then NSW Govt brought in the pokie tax and everything changed over night.
Leagues clubs operate under a massive benefit that basically they are tax free other than the pokies but the flip side of this is that they need to adhere to very strict regulations of what they can do and where the money goes. They technically can not make a profit and must turn the money back into "the community" but of course there is a fair bit of grey area there.
Then there is the interface between the Leagues Club (completely separate entity under strict financial regulations) and the Football company.
I don’t really see the basis for the NRL or the government to step in. The NRL stepped in about 10yrs ago because Balmain couldn’t repay their loan. At that time the NRL required a shake up of the board and introduction of an independent chair and board members. Subsequent to that Wests Ashfield bought out Balmains ownership interest and basically undid the reforms that were introduced by the NRL. In and of itself it isn’t a problem that Wests, as owner, has stacked the Wests Tigers board (given they own the club) but it becomes a problem for fans and other stakeholders when the decisions of Wests Ashfield (and their delegates) make the NRL club unsuccessful. The problem I have as a fan now is that I think my club is being run by incompetent people. Given the governance structures selected by Wests Ashfield that means that in practice I have zero say in how the club should be run and zero ability to influence change. Literally the only thing that I can change at Wests Tigers is to withdraw my financial support for the club (modest as that may be) in the hope that if enough members did the same it may for the owner to acknowledge that changes need to be made. In reality, when the NRL gives each clubs a grant that is $5m bigger than the salary cap, it is virtually impossible to send a club bankrupt these days no matter how incompetent.
one last point. It was Barry O’Farrell who was chairman when the centre of excellence was funded by the government. Pascoe has been dining out on the COE as evidence of his success but my guess is it was Barry who was more important when it came time to get money out of the state and federal liberal parties.
Thanks for that regarding the Eels, clarifying that situation.I understand that which is why I think the NRL should step in. If I recall correctly something similar happened at the Eels with racing & gaming stepping in and forcing independence of the football club from the Parramatta leagues club. Since that happened the Eels football club has improved greatly, making the grand final last year.Some good points Mike, but the flaw is that Wests Tigers Football Club is a seperate company to WA/HBG. No owner of any private company is ever going to agree to having a totally independent board that is independent of the owner and capital and this is also not desirable because it is instable. IMO the board should be changed to a majority WA/HBG, one Balmain seat and the balance actually independednt and as you say appointed via targeted recruitment.
NRL cant step in. Racing and gaming will only step in if laws or governance regulations are broken. Wests Ashfield and Parra Leagues are licensed clubs which operate under massive tax advantages supposedly for the community advantage and OLGA (racing and gaming) watch them all like a hawk. My recollection of the issue with Parra was it was the same board (not the same at Tigers)
Not that I am expecting anything to actually happen but surely the NRL can step in as they issue the licence and hold the Wests Tigers trade mark.
If the Tigers keep maintaining their obligations I dont think the NRL can do anything, however I am concerned that if the current level of incompetence continues, most income streams other than the grant are going to dry up and we could be in trouble.
